Wednesday, December 3, 2008

time and space and how much?

what does it say about me that i have no interest in lds blogs and blogging right now? that i have no interest in listening to another "righteous" soul proclaiming that my views and those with views like mine are misguided, ill-informed or ignorant in the ways of the lord.

does it mean anything that i just don't care- that i've got no fight in me? or is this part of the normal up and down cycle of life?

i will write more about this tomorrow after tonight's meeting with the bishop.


  1. A time to heal
    A time to break down
    A time to build up
    A time to weep
    A time to laugh
    A time to mourn
    A time to dance
    A time to cast away stone
    A time to gather stones
    A time to embrace
    A time to refrain from embracing

    I believe in you Melanie.

  2. ...I was waiting for your reply. i just knew you'd be the first to offer a comment.thanks les-for not letting me down.

    cyclical eh?

    you are lds- through and through. your family is, probably most of your friends are, your church calling is very important.

    your whole world is built on being lds, whereas, only a goodly portion of my life is.

    how do you handle your "times" of apathy (assuming you have apathetic periods)

    if you don't feel like broadcasting your thoughts here you know my email.

  3. did i use "goodly"

    forgive me, please.

  4. You are opening the doors to a very delicate conversation, which I will hesitantly keep public, though I don't know if what I have to add will help much.

    I don't know if apathy is the right word for what I sometimes feel. From time to time I do get discouraged, or cynical, or I question. But I don't associate those feelings with apathy per se.

    So how do I handle those times? Without sounding too trite, it begins with a lot of private thinking, study, and prayer. Sometimes that resolves it. Sometimes it does not. When it doesn’t resolve it, and this may sound cheesy, but I consciously make great efforts to act for Christ. Isaiah himself called the work of God a “strange act”. Have you ever read J.D. Salinger’s Franny and Zooey? I learned this partly though reading that book, what it means to be “God’s actress”. What it means to pay close attention to our relationship with “the Fat Lady.” That may not make much sense unless you’ve read that book. But in those moments, when I’m right on the edge of something dark, it becomes terribly important to step outside of my own horror and act for the benefit of someone else. Many times as part of my church calling, and many times not. Maybe for someone I love dearly, or maybe the very person (or type of person) that has caused such distress in the first place. I try incredibly hard, and as best I know how, to be “God’s actress.” And after doing that I’ve never come away from any problem, or question, or cynicism where I don’t feel completely capable of moving forward, and doing so in Christ.

    It becomes a powerful reminder of (and has often created) some undeniable spiritual experiences that anchor me in a testimony of the Godhead and his Church. I'm very invested in my Church, and I'm very invested in my relationship with Jesus Christ. And through it all it has become impossible for me to continue a relationship with the one without having the relationship with the other.

  5. "You are opening the doors to a very delicate conversation"

    oh i know!

    i've been blogging for years and i am just now finding the courage to discuss my private feelings.

    thanks for giving me some of yours.


  6. Thanks for not being afraid to discuss your private (now public)feelings.

    There is only so much I feel at ease laying out in what is supposed to be a mere "comment". It is a conversation that I'm sure would go great with Les & Christy and a bowl of ice cream. Or hot cocoa.

  7. If you're anything like me, its a cyclical thing. At times I throw myself into the mix with abandon, and other times I can't even stand to "hear" someone else talk about theology and faith.

    Same goes for all sorts of other topics I've got up in my blog roll.

    Sometimes you just gotta recharge.

    I wouldn't worry about it, unless you're apathetic about everything right now.

    Hope your visit goes well.

  8. I wouldn't worry about it, unless you're apathetic about everything right now.

    if this is the case, maybe i should reschedule the bishop and see the doc instead, eh?

  9. I have been dealing with this lately as well. I describe it as an ebb and flow of my testimony. A few years ago it was all flow and I was completely and totally in - performing spirituality in every way out of desire and testimony! It was great to feel so sure of everything.

    I have been ebbing lately, going through the motions and allowing myself to perform much less. I stick with family prayer, but my personal performance is sorely lacking right now. My solace is in the knoweldge that I have felt more and less in the past, and feel sure to feel more in the future.

    I don't know if I wouldn't worry about it, but I definitely wouldn't condemn yourself over it.

    I don't know if this helps, but I so admire you for posting on this subject. It is something we (LDS folks) forget to talk about without blaming the person: testimonies aren't always strong, and it's not always a result of not trying - sometimes it's the nature of the beast.

  10. mfranti, very touching, very touching. I would like to agree with Les, I find his words very comforting, and (his words) are the reason I keep going. I have found there is a cycle to everything, ups and downs, forwards and backwards. When I get to this place (my friend always has to remind me)that I need to remember to connect to Mother Earth below, and Father in Heaven above.

    Mother earth gives, well, what mother earth gives. Love growth, appreciation, development, beauty, compassion, nurture, nature, peace. Father in Heaven above gives us all of those things plus, plus everything else we need. It isn't always easy to stay connected, but it is always worth it (in my own my and my own experiences).

    Our lives are about cycles, and if we acknowledge those cycles that are detrimental then we can break them and change for the better.

    Love ya mfranti. You're what I want to be when I grow up...

  11. I think some clarification might be in order. I had thought that you meant you felt weary of discussing religious topics, but that you still felt comfortable with the gospel and your testimony. I get the impression that others are taking your words to mean that your testimony itself is flagging a bit. Was I wrong?

  12. Meeting with the bish?


    Err, are you okay, Mel?

  13. derek,

    tesitmony? what's that? is that the glue that's supposed to keep one going to church or is it a set of beliefs that one carries with them regardless of activity level?

    my testimony of god is good. even my testimony of the BOM and JS are good.

    my testimony about the lds church's current political stand? not so good.

    can i sustain the leadership of the church at this time? no

    do i believe that the lds church is the only way to get to God?

    no way. so um...yeah. i have a problem-according to lds theology

    not to worry. life goes on.

    sorry les.

  14. ...and now that i've seen the bishop i am not so weary of talking about religious topics.

  15. Please don't feel like you have to apologize to me.

  16. k,i'm well. better than i've been in while.

    les, i would hate to offend you with my thinking. you too sunshine. you guys are so faithful.

  17. "When it doesn’t resolve it, and this may sound cheesy, but I consciously make great efforts to act for Christ. Isaiah himself called the work of God a “strange act”."

    i absolutely love this! i do believe i will be working on this in the coming weeks

  18. Gotcha. I see what you mean.

    Can't say I haven't had some combination of the same issues at some time or another.

    Like you, I feel fairly comfortable with my feelings about God. The Church...That can be more tenuous.

    Can't speak for everyone else, but I don't offend easy when it comes to metaphysical discussions.

    Regardless of how you feel about the Church, I'm glad you feel more comfortable after your chat with the bishop.

  19. And what better time of year to try to act for Christ? I think that advice is great. After all, clear away all the junk which has accreted onto the Gospel, that is what it all boils down to, isn't it? The two great commandments? Everything else can work itself out (or take a flying leap...)

  20. We, each of us, have been given something that we are good at, some spiritual gift has been given us, and talents, many, many talents...for example, I find you to be incredibly educated, smart minded, clear spoken, and it seems you were born with a mind for politics. You are good at that. That is your strength(or one of them). That, however, is not my strength. I am quick to judge, slow to understand, and a big fat pain because I can't always read into what people are saying, but, I still have strengths. They are not yours, nor anyone else that comments here.

    I am the PTA treasurer. It's not what I do. Money isn't my strength. I want it to be, I so want it to be..but it isn't, and I have made mistakes with being the treasurer, and my friend/PTA president called me out on it and really made me feel like a fool. I doubted myself, judged myself so harshly I wanted to crawl into a closet and sit in the dark, all alone.

    Until my other friend/therapist reminded me that we are all made differently. We all have different strengths, which led me to ask why (more why my friend didn't see my strength) but why we as people don't value others therapist told me something kind of profound, she said "because we are to worried about our own to focus on others". I started thinking about my strengths and how I could use what I can do in my job as the treasurer. I can be creative, so I have begun to think creatively with money, with charts, with balancing a check book. It seems so much less mind numbing, boring when I take a different look at it. I still do the same thing, but with a different outlook, which now makes me think about you. So, you don't like where the church is politically? How can you use that to your strength? How can you work through this frustration, (whatever other emotion you have with the situation) and work through it using your strengths? We are all made different. Just because Les, and I have found the place of peace for us, doesn't mean it is the only way.

    You get to find what works for you, and, sometimes everything in our life, all of our beliefs, thoughts and decisions will be tested and tried.

  21. I'm horribly curious as to more of what you're going through. Of course you're under absolutely no obligation to tell me any more, but I feel rather isolated at the moment, just aching for someone to relate with.

    We're seeing our bishop this next Sunday for tithing settlement. We wonder if it'll turn into something more...

    This last political cycle brought much to the forefront of my mind as well. Revelations abound. Testimonies crumbling. Second thoughts everywhere.

    I believe in God. I know he's there, but I'm not so sure about the nitty gritty anymore. This Church isn't for everyone (how long it took me to be able to say that), and while it's been good for me for these past ten years, I have to wonder about a few things, if I'll be in it for the next ten or not.

    It's absolutely frightening to say aloud. Thanks.

  22. Best of luck, my imaginary (though most definitely real) friend.

  23. Sunshine, I really, really hope this doesn't come across the wrong way - but when I read about your "creative accounting" it really made me laugh in light of the current global financial crisis! See, you ARE good with money - just as good as the heads of Citicorps and Lehman Bro's and Fannie and Freddie! :-)

    I think one of your strengths is your empathy. I appreciate that about you. (And I'm hoping in light of my first paragraph, another strength is a sense of humour - because I really am just kidding about the "creative accounting" stuff.)

  24. ...and sunshine is always eager to learn and she's not afraid to change her mind when given new information.

    very admirable trait

  25. **Snort**

    And here I try to find a way to describe something in a beautiful way and it's picked to pieces! *chuckle* guess I will just have to go be 'creative' somewhere else!!

    See, quimby, how the crap do you do that? You can make anything turn into politics. Amazing!

    Thanks mfranti... that means a lot!

  26. Okay, now I am really laughing. I so didn't mean it that way, but, now that you mention it quimby, it is dang funny. Dang it... just once... I tell you...

  27. ...sorry one more...

    thank you quimby...


What is your footprint?

Ecological Footprint Quiz by Redefining Progress